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[Discussion] - S2E05 "Saints of Imperfection" Discussion

Started By:
Three of Seven, Thu 14 Feb, 2019 5:30 PM
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View Poll Results: What did you think of the Episode?

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  • Liked it

    11 64.71%
  • Neither liked or disliked it

    2 11.76%
  • Disliked it

    4 23.53%
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    #1
    attachment.php?attachmentid=7522
    EPISODE DISCUSSION:
    Saints of Imperfection

    This thread is for pre and post episode discussion of the 5th episode from season 2, Saints of Imperfection. If you do not wish for spoilers, then you have missed all the warnings in the title and activity stream, shocking! So if you are reading this post, then you should turn away now.

    The episode first airs on the 14th of Febuary for American viewers and the 15th of Febuary for international viewers.
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    #2
    Ok so I actually started to enjoy episode about half way through. I’m starting to dislike how Section 31 is known by everyone and answerable to the likes of a Starfleet Admiral. It removes the mystery and intrigue that DS9 portrayed them to have.

    However, I really liked that they brought Dr Culber back, I was actually really happy that they found a way to do that, although the explanation was a little “off”. I hope he returns as a regular cast member again and serves as Discoverys CMO.
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    #3
    I thought that was a pretty decent episode. Good bit of mystery about the "monster" which was cool (I honestly was expecting Lorca to be the monster ravaging the network to hunt down Discovery for revenge).

    Getting the Doc back was pretty well done though and it sort of hints at where the spore drive might be heading. If they decide that jumping through there is messing up a dimension full of innocent lifeforms then I guess it might get abandoned eventually, it does kinda go against the Federation's principles at that point.

    The stuff with Spock is still a bit distracting and I'm sure it could have been done without him being involved. But the nature of the red lights seems to be getting quite interesting though, possible time travel is always a bit iffy in Trek but this could be a fun ride.

    I thought the whole half-jump into the network was really cool and the visuals of the ship slowly being eaten like a sinking ship in the sea were quite cool.

    S31 seems a bit too common knowledge but i guess it'll get more depth in the stand alone show. It's certainly an interesting sideline, doing the dirty so that the guys like Pike can do their exploration in safety. I think that is a really interesting side of the Federation to explore, the dirtier side of things that go behind the pristine, utopia of the future.
    SulMatuul
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    #4
    Ok so I actually started to enjoy episode about half way through. I’m starting to dislike how Section 31 is known by everyone and answerable to the likes of a Starfleet Admiral. It removes the mystery and intrigue that DS9 portrayed them to have.

    However, I really liked that they brought Dr Culber back, I was actually really happy that they found a way to do that, although the explanation was a little “off”. I hope he returns as a regular cast member again and serves as Discoverys CMO.
    Perhaps by the time DS9 comes around in the timeline Section 31's existence becomes suppressed or it quietly fades away. Almost becoming mythical if you will.

    I was also happy to see the return of Dr. Culber. The wait for Spock though is killing me! lol
    Jbyb04
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    #5
    Ok so I actually started to enjoy episode about half way through. I’m starting to dislike how Section 31 is known by everyone and answerable to the likes of a Starfleet Admiral. It removes the mystery and intrigue that DS9 portrayed them to have.

    However, I really liked that they brought Dr Culber back, I was actually really happy that they found a way to do that, although the explanation was a little “off”. I hope he returns as a regular cast member again and serves as Discoverys CMO.
    It was definitely a creative way to bring him back. I hope he is back as well although I do not believe he was ever CMO on Discovery.
    Rellimie
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    #6
    Perhaps by the time DS9 comes around in the timeline Section 31's existence becomes suppressed or it quietly fades away. Almost becoming mythical if you will.

    I was also happy to see the return of Dr. Culber. The wait for Spock though is killing me! lol
    They could be leading up to a plot where Section 31 is destroyed, or at least appears that way, either by the hands of Starfleet or a hostile force. What better way to disappear into the shadows and not be followed when everyone thinks you're dead?

    That may tie it back into their seemingly mythical status in DS9 - by that point, they've gone underground and covered their tracks so well that they've been forgotten about and the very mention of them to the population is just dismissed as a rumour or fictional story.

    Compared to the likes of the Tal Shiar or Obsidian Order, S31 appears to have mastered the art of effectively hiding in plain sight.
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    #7
    I agree that the whole season so far is just one big tease for Spock, in every episode thus far, he has been mentioned at least once. When we got the shuttle seen and they brought it onboard and who comes out of "spocks" shuttle? Georgiou. Whilst it was unexpected, it felt like Alex Kurtzman just gave us all the bird.
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    #8
    I'm still watching it, but had to laugh off at what just happend when Georgiou, Pike and Burnham enter the turbolift.
    "This will explain things Captain" **Takes out Section 31 black badge from her pocket as if offering a cookie**
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    #9
    Mmmmmmmmm Cookies

    Starfleet Delta Shaped Cookies. lol

    I actually enjoyed the Burnham & Georgiou dialogue. I almost like the Emperor more than the Captain.
    Jbyb04
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    #10
    Some dialogue was great. Thankfully the doctor is still dead (yet sad they killed him off so soon). Pike shows off more awesomeness.

    Overall, very meh to the point I felt like I wasted time.
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    #11
    Thankfully the doctor is still dead (yet sad they killed him off so soon)
    What do you mean? Dr. Culber is now back at the Discovery, alive
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    #12
    The episodes are getting dummer and dummer, the dead doctor magically transferred over Stements into the Fungus Network just by him holding the corps into his hands, at least this is the last episode written by the fired people.

    My favorite part again is S31, it was so secret in that Archer the Captain of the most important ship in Earth Starfleet had now idea about them, suddenly everyone knows about them and than in the 24th Century S31 what's that.
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    #13
    What do you mean? Dr. Culber is now back at the Discovery, alive
    Oh yeah. Thank you for reminding me that I slept through some of it Sad
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    #14
    I enjoyed the episode, very Star Trek IMO. I'm not so sure about all this S31 stuff, if they simply would have said Starfleet Intelligence it would have been fine. I like how Stamets was the problem solver and not Burnham this time. I'm hoping the new writers will move this more and more to an ensemble show but I doubt it as I'm sure actor contracts play a roll. My quick notes:

    - The Path to not using the Spore network anymore is clear.
    - I would love a Capt Pike show, he really is becoming one of my favorite characters
    - They are starting to sneak some treknobabble into the dialog which is welcome. Just hope they don't go over the top like TNG and VOY.
    - I haven't decided if I'm a fan of S31 or not yet. I do know less is more though.
    - I thought the visuals in this episode were pretty good. Loved it when they walked on the hull of Discovery. I also liked the tractor pods the S31 ship used to help anchor Discovery.
    - Avoiding the Mycelium wall by huddling on one corner of the bridge reminded me of the TNG episode Starship Mine

    I find it interesting based on the last episode and next-weeks preview that they are weaving in the shorts. I'm wondering if the advanced AI in Discovery's computer system will somehow be associated with the massive data dump from last week?

    Was Orville a new episode? If so I'll have to rip it online.
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    • Three of Seven
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    #15
    Back to the Burnham-centric episode. Episode starts with Burnham running to the rescue, opening narrative in tow.

    Burnham invites herself along with Stamets to search for Tilly in Spore World. When everyone knows that time is an issue, they still take the time to work their feels out before heading back to the spore chamber. Culber's resurrection was unbelievable...lazy writing. Because we want him back...magic! He's back! I don't appreciate lazy writing.

    I like this version of Georgiou, though I would prefer a more invisible Section 31. As portrayed in this episode, Section 31 has a VERY Tal Shiar quality about them.

    More Spock teasing. Ugh...

    To finish the episode off, we get another self-righteous narrative from Burnham, with her making her grand entrance on the bridge, resuming her post at her station.

    This episode had potential, but once again, it was wasted. Unnecessary, forced drama, followed by unearned, drawn out moments for emotional responses from the cast, when the lives of the entire crew are at risk. This behavior is expected from teenagers, but professional, trained military officers wouldn't even be considering their feels until the mission was over, and the ship was safe. I'm watching Star Trek: High School! I hope that the writing is better going forward.

    I gave last week's episode a pass, because it appeared that they were moving towards better character development, and more ensemble involvement. This week was a total reversion to Burnham-centricity. I did not enjoy this week's episode.

    I'm not a Discovery hater. I love Star Trek, and will continue to watch Discovery, if only to encourage more Star Trek development in the future. Discovery can usually be entertaining sci-fi, if I don't think about it very much. It's not the Star Trek that I want, but it's the Star Trek that we've got.
    Morris
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