[Shadowmeph]

If I had to ask one question of the writers, it'd be, "Why did you make Burnham so whiny?"

Captain: Commander Stamets will lead the mission down to the planet.
Burnham: I should be the one to go down, she's MY mother.
Captain: You're not going, other people are better for this mission.
Burnham: But my momma..
Captain: Once again, no. Stamets has got this.
Burnham: Pleeeeeease.

After they wrote some really good scenes and banter between her and Spock, they reduce her to an unprofessional, immature mess.

But, it was good to see the doc back on his feet and in uniform again.

Michelle Yeoh continues to be the best thing about this show.

exactly what I see and to me it is almost sickening to see how whinny she is, I like Michelle Yeoh in Discovery. maybe it is just because I am old School and we dont "Whine" about things we just do it

[Three of Seven]

1: Must be a Burnham family trait to be arrogant, and feel they are right about everything.
2: Shaky cam, and wonky cam, who filmed this? Me?
3: Spock is Dyslexic, pointless bit of information.
4: Wheelchair officer is back again, I'm all for inclusivity, but you whouldn't have someone in a wheelchair on a military vessel, and surly they have the technology to make them able to walk again. It's pointless inclusion, it is not logical.
5: This is less Science Fiction, more Science Fantasy.
6: I am glad they have managed to get some basic science right.
7: Very soap opera elements to it, maybe that's hip with the kids these days.
8: I wish other characters got more screentime still.
9: It was better than last weeks.

[Stormy]

If you take the whiny crybaby out of this episode, it's pretty darn good in my opinion. Of course, it appears the writers are determined to undermine everything DISCO could be by overdeloping their biggest flaw.... the name of whom I shall not speak. For me, I find myself torn. In some ways I feel the show is getting better... but not at the same rate as it's geting worse.

I did think it interesting the writers decided to foreshadow the departure of Pike from the show... and we can only hope for a spinoff series. If that were to happen I doubt I would bother to keep up with DISCO any more.

[LogicalLeopard]

If I had to ask one question of the writers, it'd be, "Why did you make Burnham so whiny?"

Captain: Commander Stamets will lead the mission down to the planet.
Burnham: I should be the one to go down, she's MY mother.
Captain: You're not going, other people are better for this mission.
Burnham: But my momma..
Captain: Once again, no. Stamets has got this.
Burnham: Pleeeeeease.

After they wrote some really good scenes and banter between her and Spock, they reduce her to an unprofessional, immature mess.

But, it was good to see the doc back on his feet and in uniform again.

Michelle Yeoh continues to be the best thing about this show.

Why is Burnham whiny? I'll tell you this. If I found out my dad was alive after the last 26 years, or my mom was alive after the last 12 years, and my boss told me I wasn't going to be the first to see them, I'd be pretty ticked. Whiny is the best you'd get from me. Straight up insubordination is more likely.

This is a totally natural, human reaction. The writers nailed it.

- - - Updated - - -

1: Must be a Burnham family trait to be arrogant, and feel they are right about everything.
2: Shaky cam, and wonky cam, who filmed this? Me?
3: Spock is Dyslexic, pointless bit of information.
4: Wheelchair officer is back again, I'm all for inclusivity, but you whouldn't have someone in a wheelchair on a military vessel, and surly they have the technology to make them able to walk again. It's pointless inclusion, it is not logical.
5: This is less Science Fiction, more Science Fantasy.
6: I am glad they have managed to get some basic science right.
7: Very soap opera elements to it, maybe that's hip with the kids these days.
8: I wish other characters got more screentime still.
9: It was better than last weeks.

1)They said it was in the episode *L*
4) Seeing the wheelchair officer is jarring, but sadly no, they can't cure all spinal disorders in the 23rd century. If you remember, Worf was going to commit suicide after an accident left him paralyzed. The tech they had would make him stagger like a robot through the halls. An experimental, risky operation had to be done. And that was in the 24th century. So Wheelchair Guy probably thought this was a better fix.
6) Did they? I couldn't tell, and just went with it.



Some other notes:

We finally get a hint about Burnhams name. Her father's name is Mike. She might be a junior. I've seen one female to female junior in real life. The concept of a male to female junior is interesting. Of course, she's probably not a junior and is more like a GW Bush.

About the Borg thing, it seems likely that Leland will somehow get stranded across time and space in the Delta quadrant and become the Borg, but who knows.

[Three of Seven]

1)They said it was in the episode *L*
4) Seeing the wheelchair officer is jarring, but sadly no, they can't cure all spinal disorders in the 23rd century. If you remember, Worf was going to commit suicide after an accident left him paralyzed. The tech they had would make him stagger like a robot through the halls. An experimental, risky operation had to be done. And that was in the 24th century. So Wheelchair Guy probably thought this was a better fix.
6) Did they? I couldn't tell, and just went with it.

1: I was making this list as I was watching the episode, they said that after.
4: If it's an uncurable wheelchair bound illness, then they should have been assigned as Starbase personal, or other admin roles, not on a military vessel. For the safety of themselves, and others, getting into an escape pod with a wheelchair is not going to be easy, in the same way it's not easy to evacuate people in a fire with a wheelchair. Worf of course would not have wanted an admin role.
6: Yeah, some basic things like Newtons Law, completly pointless to bring up in the show, but they seemed to get it right, from my Secondary School knowladge of science.

[casualsto]

I've noticed a trend in DSC. They toy around with vague references, then flip the story up.

This angel figure looked and resembled something that an iconian would do in the first episode.

Now this nanite-infection thing looks similarly to the Borgs. Now we're again wondering if this is the starting point of the Borg.

I'm okay with the show, I'm just ... Baited with a cool trek reference, then served a lazy plot device in the next episode. Typical Star Trek Discovery.

Captain Pike is being bashed again and again. Everyone keeps flailing at his authority constantly - so non starfleet-ish. Guess that's what the straight white guy with a sense of responsibility gets from all of the other minority groups these days (lol).

Burnham is one of the most lousy main characters ... She simply can't take the spotlight, even if the story should be around her. I somewhat understand the spite some old school trek fans got about her.

And don't tell me this is about skin color. There is an amazing scene in an episode from DS9 where an elder Jake Sisqo has an emotional talk with his father, Benjamin, as Benjamin gets killed accidentally while they were on the Defiant and Jake dedicates his life into finding and bringing his father back after having periodically some temporal flashes where his father appears. That is trully an emotional scene at the end of the episode between two amazing men of color.

Burnham simply doesn't cut it, even if they try to Mary Sue her at every turn. It's a shallow character that gets shadowed by everyone in that show excepting Tilly - which should be the cringe/comical release.

I hope DSC turns things around.

Every episode of this show leaves me with mostly nothing from the plotline. It's been about 11 episodes and the best one was the one where we had less Bernham and more Trek - the one where Saruu and his kind found out the truth about their race and planet - which was a really good episode.

That's my two cents (under a magnifying glass)

[LogicalLeopard]

1: I was making this list as I was watching the episode, they said that after.
4: If it's an uncurable wheelchair bound illness, then they should have been assigned as Starbase personal, or other admin roles, not on a military vessel. For the safety of themselves, and others, getting into an escape pod with a wheelchair is not going to be easy, in the same way it's not easy to evacuate people in a fire with a wheelchair. Worf of course would not have wanted an admin role.
6: Yeah, some basic things like Newtons Law, completly pointless to bring up in the show, but they seemed to get it right, from my Secondary School knowladge of science.

4) Seems like he's plenty fast and capable, and might be able to get into an escape pod faster than others. Seems to me his disability doesn't really get in the way of shipboard life. A wheelchair may be difficult if he has to climb a Jefferies tube, but that's about it. It wouldn't necessitate a starbase assignment. At his worst, he wouldn't be any more of a hazard to move than than an injured crewman. I don't think Starfleet would have a problem, because with a wide variety of aliens, some natural qualities would seem like disabilities, because there are disparities in senses, strength, etc.

6) Oh yeah, I caught that. I was talking about the time and gravity and all of that stuff.

[Shadowmeph]

Burnham is one of the most lousy main characters ... She simply can't take the spotlight, even if the story should be around her. I somewhat understand the spite some old school trek fans got about her.

I agree she is very whiny I mean in my real world I have been through what some people would think is terrible things but I never every once whined about it she is constantly whining reminds me of a teen that at times is an adult but mostly a teen. her character is pretty week. I do get what they are attempting to do but man get a grip writers try not to satisfy every one pick a personality that is more ( star fleet) Trek then the average person and go with it. to me I can't see how she even passed any exams that would put her on a ship. the way I see her is that she should be pushing papers sure she has her moments but in my eyes if this was real world and I had the power I would have planted her on a base until she could prove that she is grown up enough to handle the unpredictability of space exploration and ship life .

[Three of Seven]

4) Seems like he's plenty fast and capable, and might be able to get into an escape pod faster than others. Seems to me his disability doesn't really get in the way of shipboard life. A wheelchair may be difficult if he has to climb a Jefferies tube, but that's about it. It wouldn't necessitate a starbase assignment. At his worst, he wouldn't be any more of a hazard to move than than an injured crewman. I don't think Starfleet would have a problem, because with a wide variety of aliens, some natural qualities would seem like disabilities, because there are disparities in senses, strength, etc.

I really doubt it, as someone who has worked in disability, I can tell you that for a wheelchair user to be evacuated, they will need the help of someone else, unless of course they are on the ground floor. He would be on par with injured crewmen, however his safety if not injured would be put below those who are injured because triage.

The paperwork for having an officer in a wheelchair on a military vessel would be extream, he'd have to be very important to the mission at hand! People not in wheelchair would be able to get into an escape pod quicker, since there's probably no ramp going in, the door is narrow, and a wheelchair is going to take up a seat, so someone would need to help the officer out of the wheelchair, and into a seat in the escape pod, the wheelchair would be lost with the ship, as it's not essential, the life of a person is.

If the ship comes under fire, and a hit causes the person to fall out of their wheelchair, it's going to mean one, or two officers have to stop what they are doing to get the person back into their chair. Yes, you could say that an injured crew member could cause the same problem, however, if he is not injured, mearly deseated, it's a dealy that can be costly.

He may very well be capable though, infact he probably is, being in a wheelchair doesn't make anyone less capable at various things, but the risks of putting them on a military vessel is not something that should be taken.

We also come to the Chekhov's Gun concept, why have an officer in a wheelchair, if they are never going to come into play in the story? Since wheelchair uses on a military vessel are not commonplace, it means there should be some explination offered in the show somehow.

I really think though, much like saying Spock had Dyslexia, it is just a minor detail added in at attempt to make everyone feel represented. While admirable, it is not what shows should really focus on, the storytelling is the important part.

[Rellimie]

I've noticed a trend in DSC. They toy around with vague references, then flip the story up.

This angel figure looked and resembled something that an iconian would do in the first episode.

Now this nanite-infection thing looks similarly to the Borgs. Now we're again wondering if this is the starting point of the Borg.

I'm okay with the show, I'm just ... Baited with a cool trek reference, then served a lazy plot device in the next episode. Typical Star Trek Discovery.

Captain Pike is being bashed again and again. Everyone keeps flailing at his authority constantly - so non starfleet-ish. Guess that's what the straight white guy with a sense of responsibility gets from all of the other minority groups these days (lol).

Burnham is one of the most lousy main characters ... She simply can't take the spotlight, even if the story should be around her. I somewhat understand the spite some old school trek fans got about her.

And don't tell me this is about skin color. There is an amazing scene in an episode from DS9 where an elder Jake Sisqo has an emotional talk with his father, Benjamin, as Benjamin gets killed accidentally while they were on the Defiant and Jake dedicates his life into finding and bringing his father back after having periodically some temporal flashes where his father appears. That is trully an emotional scene at the end of the episode between two amazing men of color.

Burnham simply doesn't cut it, even if they try to Mary Sue her at every turn. It's a shallow character that gets shadowed by everyone in that show excepting Tilly - which should be the cringe/comical release.

I hope DSC turns things around.

Every episode of this show leaves me with mostly nothing from the plotline. It's been about 11 episodes and the best one was the one where we had less Bernham and more Trek - the one where Saruu and his kind found out the truth about their race and planet - which was a really good episode.

That's my two cents (under a magnifying glass)

So, I'm not even sure what the point of most of your comment is other than to trying to once again bring politics into a friendly community discussion about Star Trek. You are the only one in this discussion (unless I missed it) that brought up sexual orientation and race. Neither of which has anything to do with this episode.

Also, you may want to look up the definition of "Mary Sue" because season 2 Burnham (like her or not) is an emotional mess that is constantly making mistakes and the one fight she was in she got her butt kicked. A true "Mary Sue" would be the stable, voice of reason, that is always right, always saving the day, and never loses a fight. Don't mistake Burnham being the main character of the show with her being a "Mary Sue".

I hope we can continue friendly discussions in this community about the franchise we love without having to slide pointless political topics that frankly just exists to trigger people.

[LogicalLeopard]

I really doubt it, as someone who has worked in disability, I can tell you that for a wheelchair user to be evacuated, they will need the help of someone else, unless of course they are on the ground floor. He would be on par with injured crewmen, however his safety if not injured would be put below those who are injured because triage.

The paperwork for having an officer in a wheelchair on a military vessel would be extream, he'd have to be very important to the mission at hand! People not in wheelchair would be able to get into an escape pod quicker, since there's probably no ramp going in, the door is narrow, and a wheelchair is going to take up a seat, so someone would need to help the officer out of the wheelchair, and into a seat in the escape pod, the wheelchair would be lost with the ship, as it's not essential, the life of a person is.

If the ship comes under fire, and a hit causes the person to fall out of their wheelchair, it's going to mean one, or two officers have to stop what they are doing to get the person back into their chair. Yes, you could say that an injured crew member could cause the same problem, however, if he is not injured, mearly deseated, it's a dealy that can be costly.

He may very well be capable though, infact he probably is, being in a wheelchair doesn't make anyone less capable at various things, but the risks of putting them on a military vessel is not something that should be taken.

We also come to the Chekhov's Gun concept, why have an officer in a wheelchair, if they are never going to come into play in the story? Since wheelchair uses on a military vessel are not commonplace, it means there should be some explination offered in the show somehow.

I really think though, much like saying Spock had Dyslexia, it is just a minor detail added in at attempt to make everyone feel represented. While admirable, it is not what shows should really focus on, the storytelling is the important part.

That the thing, we're talking about a Starfleet science vessel. The only real drawbacks you mentioned is that he might fall over and might not be able to get into an escape pod easily. Things that 1) would rarely happen during a scientific mission, and 2) would apply to wounded crew. There is not much difference there, and no reason to exclude him. Why is he there? Well he's probably good at what he does. *L* Sure, it's a representation thing, but if we want to go deeper, we can start to question why there are so many women, because they might not be able to lift another crewman in an emergency. It's a bad road to go down.

Representation just makes Star Trek look like our world. That's what it excelled at, and it pushed our understanding of the capabilities of others. As ridiculous as it was to have a black woman on the bridge working technical equipment, instead of being a maid, it served to make people realize it wasn't that ridiculous at all.

I'll be honest. I thought the wheelchair scene in this was gratuitous when I saw it. But then I thought, what's so gratuitous about it? He just rolled by like a person would walk by. There's tons of people all that walk and stand around. If a wheelchair doesn't prevent him from doing the job, why do I care?

[Rellimie]

That the thing, we're talking about a Starfleet science vessel. The only real drawbacks you mentioned is that he might fall over and might not be able to get into an escape pod easily. Things that 1) would rarely happen during a scientific mission, and 2) would apply to wounded crew. There is not much difference there, and no reason to exclude him. Why is he there? Well he's probably good at what he does. *L* Sure, it's a representation thing, but if we want to go deeper, we can start to question why there are so many women, because they might not be able to lift another crewman in an emergency. It's a bad road to go down.

Representation just makes Star Trek look like our world. That's what it excelled at, and it pushed our understanding of the capabilities of others. As ridiculous as it was to have a black woman on the bridge working technical equipment, instead of being a maid, it served to make people realize it wasn't that ridiculous at all.

I'll be honest. I thought the wheelchair scene in this was gratuitous when I saw it. But then I thought, what's so gratuitous about it? He just rolled by like a person would walk by. There's tons of people all that walk and stand around. If a wheelchair doesn't prevent him from doing the job, why do I care?

Is Starfleet considered a “military” in the traditional sense? I know their are ranks and court marshals and chain of command but in the Star Trek universe it’s not just a standard military.

Also, we have had other officers in wheelchairs. I believe there was one on DS9.

[LogicalLeopard]

Is Starfleet considered a “military” in the traditional sense? I know their are ranks and court marshals and chain of command but in the Star Trek universe it’s not just a standard military.

Also, we have had other officers in wheelchairs. I believe there was one on DS9.

Yeah, Melora Panzar on DS 9 was in a wheelchair because she was from a low gravity world and it was easier for her to get around that way. But that's an example about how if Starfleet makes exceptions for alien traits, they'd make them for human disabilities.

Starfleet is a paradox. It is not meant to be a military, but an exploring and scientific force. At the same time, it is the military branch of protection for the Federation as well. But at any rate, it's not a pure military.

[Asteropax]

Yeah, Melora Panzar on DS 9 was in a wheelchair because she was from a low gravity world and it was easier for her to get around that way. But that's an example about how if Starfleet makes exceptions for alien traits, they'd make them for human disabilities.

Starfleet is a paradox. It is not meant to be a military, but an exploring and scientific force. At the same time, it is the military branch of protection for the Federation as well. But at any rate, it's not a pure military.

To me, Starfleet is a scientific and exploration fleet which has the secondary purpose of a defense force. The military ranks provide an organizational structure to Starfleet's operations. Combat is not a primary concern to Starfleet but one they acknowledge due to the many threats ships on exploration and scientific duties may possibly face.

[Mack]

Is Starfleet considered a “military” in the traditional sense? I know their are ranks and court marshals and chain of command but in the Star Trek universe it’s not just a standard military.

Also, we have had other officers in wheelchairs. I believe there was one on DS9.

Basically, Starfleet and their officers become what their situation demands off them.

While not limited to anything, Starfleet’s primary mission is exploration.