[Petrarch]

Attachment 14328

Episode Discussion

"There is a Tide..."

US Airdate: 31/12/2020 (CBS All Access)
International: 01/01/2021 (Netflix)

This thread is for the pre and post discussion of the Season 3 penultimate episode "There is a Tide..." - this will be a spoiler filled discussion so if you've found your way past the warnings in the activity stream and the spoiler tag on the thread, this is your last chance to turn back, or at least it will be at the end of this first post. You have been warned!

While an answer for the Burn has been found, more immediate matters take priority. With the Emerald Chain having captured Discovery and heading straight for Federation Headquarters, the crew attempt to beat the odds and retake control of the ship.

Some promo shots of the upcoming episode can be found here.

Frakes returns as director for this one and it was originally titled "The Good of the People" - the new title comes from Shakespeare's Julius Caesar:

There is a tide in the affairs of men.
Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune;
Omitted, all the voyage of their life
Is bound in shallows and in miseries.
On such a full sea are we now afloat,
And we must take the current when it serves,
Or lose our ventures.

"There is a Tide..." is episode 12 of 13.

Written by: Kenneth Lin
Directed by: Jonathan Frakes

[Shadowmeph]

well that was bad totally sucky episode way to touchy feely and corny for me of course I am half asleep and after reading what others post I might change my m,ind but right now it is liek watching a Saturday morning cartoon for kid touchy feely and corny

[Kyuusaku]

In writing, there's an old phrase we use when we employ comedic situations: "Buy the premise, buy the bit." I bought the premise and the bit, and I loved it. I enjoyed how they decided to raise the stakes of the dilemma, but once again, I'm disappointed that they chose killing off characters (Ryn) to act as a catalyst when we're already well aware of Osyraa's malevolence (I know it was used to cast doubt for the scientist character).

The weakest part of the episode for me was the time spent showing the negotiations, although I loved the "you're eating our sh*t" line because of how well-timed it was, and her reaction to the news. That's credit to how well the lines got delivered and the emotive response. I also feel like now we're seeing why the Emperor had to depart; no way the Chain defeats her in that situation... she's more devious than Osyraa. But, I would have loved to see Tilly and Georgiou teaming up to take her down. Might make for a cool "what if...?" story.

Also, a part of me was wondering if Osyraa has somehow subverted Eli, because she was suddenly being super truthful on everything she was saying. Then it dawned on me that in the scenes we'd see of her, she didn't really use deception as much as I thought she would. I guess if I were writing it, I might've opted to employ that as a plot device of some kind.

I'm glad to see that the Chain has moved from bogeyman-through-plenipotentiary to the full weight of what they're capable of in terms of deception. We didn't really get to see much in the way of Orions throughout Trek, so seeing them taking center stage like this has been pretty refreshing; even if they're almost a millennium removed from the Orions we got to know in the 22nd to 24th centuries.

The lantern that the writers used hinting at the eventual entry of the Sphere data was great and I loved the last lines of the episode which should lead into what I hope is a fantastic season finale.

All in all, these 23 weeks of Star Trek have been pretty incredible. Given that we had overlap with Mandalorian and Expanse, this has been an awesome year for scifi on TV.

-- Kyuu

[Jestersmith]

this has been an awesome year for scifi on TV.

-- Kyuu

I could not agree more been a while since we had a few good shows on at the same time

It was a good episode hope that next weeks season finale is epic without killing off any major characters

Killing off Ryn was the low point of the episode and seeing Kenneth Mitchell in his long awaited role in human form was a highlight.

[Arno12]

This was a nice set up episode, though Burnham radioing her mother makes me think the Ni'Var, Earth Trill and others will show up to the rescue, or maybe the Enterprise.

[darthnovawave]

Well said Kyuu. I think in general this episode was a step back in the right direction after last week, though I agree that picking Ryn to kill was a misstep. Yes, it was intended to be a catalyst for the scientist to reconsider his position, but I think the same effect could have arguably been created by Osyraa offing some random cannon fodder regulators, particularly if they were ones with faces like the token death ones from the airlock venting scene. Arguably, offing one of her own people rather than executing a prisoner would have been more powerful, so I'm guessing the writers felt like they needed a reason to stretch the internal sensor confusion bit into next episode and offing the guy who did it was the strongest excuse they could come up with to justify it.

I think the thing that may be a bit more troubling for me is the absense of any scenes back in the nebula. This leaves only one more episode to wrap up that storyline (assuming it isn't the hook leading into season 4). With next week's episode also set to be the big final showdown between Starfleet and the Emerald Chain too, it seems like the big buzz of Season 3 isn't well poised to reach a satisfying conclusion. Guess we'll see though.

[Kyuusaku]

Y'know, I'm okay with a cliffhanger episode into S4. That's definitely a Trek thing to do

-- Kyuu

[Shadowmeph]

the one scene I can think of I liked out of all was the scene of Paul being ejected into space . but the whole episode of the all of a sudden lets pause time so we are touchy and things are going bad but we will pause time so that we have time to have conversations for 1-2 minutes before things happen Discovery does this allot and it bothers me allot it in a way reminds me of the old East Indian movies where out of know where they break out in Song and dance hehe . as for the truth and lie thing well I noticed that what was said was truth but word play like lawyer speak. the knife in the leg of Burnum I mean really how is it she didnt bleed to death the knife was almost to the hilt and the leg has the largest artery in the body that reminded me of watching the old westerns of the 1950-60s where they always shot the guy tin the leg but the guy always lives stupid things like that spoil it for me. end of gripe morning n coffee time hehe

[Arno12]

Y'know I'm curious about these federation remnants Ossyra mentioned, would be a neat tie-in to Calypso if one of them was in conflict with Crafts people.

[Josh Broughm]

A GLARING ISSUE I had with this. Ossayra ACTUALLY THOUGHT she could con Emerald Chain into the Federation.......WHILE SHE F***ING HAS A STOLEN FEDERATION SHIP!!!!!! I mean Vance doesn't want to lose Disco, but C'MON!!!!! If you walk up to the front door of the prerson's house with their bike THAT YOU STOLE & tried to sell it back to them, the h*ll you'd think happen?!?!

Everything else was great, but HOLY CHRIST, that part was CONFUSING!!!

[Aleaic]

I kinda got a Die Hard vibe from the episode. And also: good to see Emperor Grudge was safe and cozy, all right before barrel smashing right into the shuttlebay. I mean, wheee! =^^=

[Sul-Matuul]

I kinda got a Die Hard vibe from the episode. And also: good to see Emperor Grudge was safe and cozy, all right before barrel smashing right into the shuttlebay. I mean, wheee! =^^=

"Now I got a phaser rifle....Ho Ho Ho"

[JByb04]

It was definitely an improvement over the last episode.

Issues from the Command Structure aside. I even laughed when Osyraa pointed out that was something she planned on exploiting.

Frakes once again = Money. That's all I can really say about this one.

[Shadowmeph]

Frakes yikes I don't care for him hehe